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mi3dot bez tablica - right here :)
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Sulien



Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Posts: 2905
Location: Zagreb

PostPosted: 25.12.2004 03:10    Post subject: mi3dot bez tablica - right here :) Add user to your forum ignore list Reply with quote

Daklem, ovo bi bio moj božićni poklon našem Dimitriju i svima vama... Budući da se toliko navlačimo sa tim CSS-om na forumima, raspravljamo o korištenju tablica ili css-a, prepucavamo se tko što može i tko što zna, kakvih hackova ima i da li se uopće isplati (a i žao mi je što se ne priča o accessibility-u previše), prezentiram vam ovo kao polu-dokaz i ohrabrenje svima što se tiče korištenja css-a.

Prezentiram vam Dimitrija samog (točnije, jednu stranicu - galeriju) kompletno u CSS-u. Tables thrown out the window Smile Interesiralo me da li se može, kako će izgledati, koliko će biti manji itd. The result is here:

Sulien painfully wrote:
http://nippur.irb.hr/~mislav/mi3dot_makeover/

- browseri koji nisu Firefox neka čitaju niže prije klikanja
- ne klikajte na linkove... ništa ne vrijede (osim par u footeru)
- no SWF... another time Smile


Ne vjerujete? CTRL+SHIFT+D ako imate Developer Toolbar Wink
Ni ja više nisam znao koji je koji kad sam radio zadnje preview-e Smile

Report:
Code:
Browser friendliness: testirano u Firefoxu, IE/Win 6 prolazi koliko toliko
   Netscape, Opera, Safari: nemam ih... sorry :(
   IE 5.x: nemojte ni pokušavati - to će biti užas
   IE 6: naći ćete neke ružnoće, pogotovo na pozadini 'featured' radova... blame M$, not me

Size reduction: veličina html-a smanjena na manje od trećinu, CSS se povećao za svega 2KB

CSS level: bio bi level 1 da nije dva elementa koja imaju apsolutno pozicioniranje

mi3 banners: apsolutno sam ih pozicionirao u dno gdje originalno i jesu, no ipak, ova metoda je skroz glupa i ne preporučam je... ako netko zna bolje, neka mi pliz javi

Hack count: 2
   razlog: izbjegavao sam hackove sve do samog kraja kad sam bio prisiljen napisati *dvije* linije posebno za IE6 da se ipak potpuno ne raspadne

Accessibility: morao sam napraviti par sitnih kompromisa kako bih zadržao originalan izgled dimitrija, što je bio prioritet... Najviše pljujem po accessibility-u što i dalje koristim 11px fixni font - ali vjerujte, drugačije nije moglo, barem ne u ovom slučaju... Unatoč svemu vjerujem da je sajt sada prilično accessible, prolazi većinu točaka 508 i wcag-aaa, a ostale neću ispravljati jer je ovo samo test

Hours spent: many... dva dana rada (uglavnom prepisivanje sadržaja, c&p doesn't quite cut it from tabled layout :)


Eto Smile Svi komentari su poželjni, svaka primjedba dobrodošla. Volio bih vas moći ohrabriti da naučite nešto iz ovog CSS-a, ali toliko se na kraju izdužio da će ga samo oni najuporniji (i najmazohističniji) moći stvarno proučiti... Inače, elementi se u CSS-u pojavljuju kako dolaze i u HTML-u, to možda malo olakša stvar.

I da... Smile Merry xmas Wink
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emptyhead
mi3.crew


Joined: 03 Sep 2003
Posts: 889
Location: Daleko od Novog Zelanda

PostPosted: 25.12.2004 03:32    Post subject: Add user to your forum ignore list Reply with quote

THX! Applause

Genijalno, ali... (ovakav pocetak recenice obozavam... Bang! Shame on you )... saxa u IE6 kao sto si i napisao - ne tolko kolko u ie5 al ipak je neiskoristivo ko cjelina.

Ono sto je najvise mrak je to sto si vjerojatno bacio rukavicu u lice ostatku css bulterijera i mahaca rukama Laughing i da ce na kraju se mi3 prebacit kao "open source css" projekt ... erm... u css skroz Smile.

Jos jednom, svaka cast na trudu, hrabrosti i rezultatu!

Applause
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Peewee



Joined: 12 Jan 2004
Posts: 711
Location: Velika Gorica

PostPosted: 25.12.2004 03:41    Post subject: Add user to your forum ignore list Reply with quote

je ti se seksualni zivot poboljso nakon ovog?
trebo bi sigurno!!!
svaka ti dala....

zakon su teme na forumu Wink

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zivili!!!
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identity



Joined: 08 Mar 2004
Posts: 16
Location: Zagreb

PostPosted: 25.12.2004 06:55    Post subject: Add user to your forum ignore list Reply with quote

brawo majstore!
Cak sam sad nesto od tebe naucio .. Very Happy
ja se vec jedno vrijeme zajebavam sa css-om za jedan malo poveci site - portal ... tako da te u potpunosti kuzim .. Very Happy u svakom slucaju brawo.
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ante



Joined: 09 Oct 2003
Posts: 255
Location: st

PostPosted: 25.12.2004 10:39    Post subject: Add user to your forum ignore list Reply with quote

"1450 registriranih i jedan gost (looser Smile " Very Happy Very Happy
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F@NTOM



Joined: 11 Sep 2003
Posts: 592
Location: Dubrovnik

PostPosted: 25.12.2004 11:06    Post subject: Add user to your forum ignore list Reply with quote

Svaka cast! Applause Applause Applause Applause
Dobio sam tolko nadahnuce da i ja nest ovako napravim. Smile
You d man! Smile

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Sulien



Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Posts: 2905
Location: Zagreb

PostPosted: 25.12.2004 11:58    Post subject: Add user to your forum ignore list Reply with quote

emptyhead wrote:
...ali saxa u IE6 kao sto si i napisao...

Ako treba dokazati da se može sredit, mogu probat Mr. Green
Sad nisam jer, rekao sam, ne volim hackiranje

Mene zanima da li se drži u Opera/Safari Confused
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maratz
mi3.crew


Joined: 24 Nov 2003
Posts: 1207
Location: ZAG

PostPosted: 25.12.2004 12:28    Post subject: Add user to your forum ignore list Reply with quote

emptyhead wrote:
Ono sto je najvise mrak je to sto si vjerojatno bacio rukavicu u lice ostatku css bulterijera i mahaca rukama Laughing i da ce na kraju se mi3 prebacit kao "open source css" projekt ... erm... u css skroz Smile.

Ma nemrem vjerovat Shocked zar na praznik??!!1
Sulien wrote:
Ako treba dokazati da se može sredit, mogu probat Mr. Green
Sad nisam jer, rekao sam, ne volim hackiranje

Dokazao si well enough. Prvo što bi trebalo popraviti je promjeniti <hr/> u <hr />, a nakon toga kompletno izbaciti <hr /> Smile Pošto je Krismas -- clearanje floata se radi definiranjem floata za parent element, dakle umjesto
Code:
.nutra { float: left; }

<div class="vani">
   <div class="nutra">
   </div>
   <hr /> <!-- <br /> or similar trendy shit -->
</div>
treba
Code:
.vani { float: left; }
.nutra { float: left; }

<div class="vani">
   <div class="nutra">
   </div>
</div>
, pa će ovaj 'nutra' širiti ovog 'vani'

Nemoj se toliko zamarati prilagođavanjem, nego još malo popravi sve to skupa za FF. Npr. puca kod resizeanja slova.
Sulien wrote:
Mene zanima da li se drži u Opera/Safari Confused

Ne, a vjerovatno ne radi niti na IE5.2

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vedran



Joined: 08 Sep 2003
Posts: 458

PostPosted: 25.12.2004 13:21    Post subject: Re: mi3dot bez tablica - right here :) Add user to your forum ignore list Reply with quote

Sulien wrote:
Daklem, ovo bi bio moj božićni poklon našem Dimitriju i svima vama...


Respect Applause

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Sulien



Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Posts: 2905
Location: Zagreb

PostPosted: 25.12.2004 13:22    Post subject: Add user to your forum ignore list Reply with quote

marac wrote:
dakle umjesto
Code:
.nutra { float: left; }

<div class="vani">
   <div class="nutra">
   </div>
   <hr /> <!-- <br /> or similar trendy shit -->
</div>
treba
Code:
.vani { float: left; }
.nutra { float: left; }

<div class="vani">
   <div class="nutra">
   </div>
</div>
, pa će ovaj 'nutra' širiti ovog 'vani'

HR-ovi nisu za clear Wink Ali jedan paragraf ("All clear") i jedan list item (&nbsp;) jesu, probat ću ovo tvoje - thnx

Quote:
Nemoj se toliko zamarati prilagođavanjem, nego još malo popravi sve to skupa za FF. Npr. puca kod resizeanja slova.

Pokušao sam, ali ne može se sve do beskonačnosti... No, dva puta se ipak može povećati font da layout ostane skupa, nakon toga se naravno raspadne kad svaki drugi element brejka iz svog containera - čak i da se ne raspadne, ne bi više bilo čitljivo

Najnezgodnije sređeni elementi su, naravno, radovi (thumbovi uz informaciju ispod) - bilo bi jednostavnije da nisam htio paziti kako bi to izgledalo bez css-a (text-based browseri), ali budući da jesam kombinirao sam spanove i divove tako da je css na tom dijelu dosta kompliciran, npr. IE totalno poludi sa marginama (smanjio ih prvim hackom) a vjerujem i drugi browseri
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Ivan Brezak Brkan



Joined: 13 Sep 2003
Posts: 1694
Location: Zagreb // Croatia

PostPosted: 25.12.2004 14:37    Post subject: Add user to your forum ignore list Reply with quote

Bravo Mislave!! Mislim, lud si ko šiba ali volimo te mi svi ma kakav bio ^^
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ars



Joined: 19 Feb 2004
Posts: 1444
Location: splite moj

PostPosted: 25.12.2004 14:40    Post subject: Add user to your forum ignore list Reply with quote

Fortius wrote:
Bravo Mislave!! Mislim, lud si ko šiba ali volimo te mi svi ma kakav bio ^^
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njava
mi3.crew


Joined: 25 Aug 2003
Posts: 624
Location: Zagreb

PostPosted: 25.12.2004 14:42    Post subject: Add user to your forum ignore list Reply with quote

emptyhead wrote:
Ono sto je najvise mrak je to sto si vjerojatno bacio rukavicu u lice ostatku css bulterijera i mahaca rukama


...at the O.K. Corral Laughing

gg sulien!
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zweistein



Joined: 14 Nov 2004
Posts: 57
Location: Pula, HR

PostPosted: 25.12.2004 14:57    Post subject: Add user to your forum ignore list Reply with quote

Eeeeeerm... Massive respect i nek' ti za ovo ispod bora osvane nešto jaaaaaako lijepo Smile. Lud lud lud lud Wink.

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and the only laws of mind are fabricated by matter.
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kelso



Joined: 19 Jul 2004
Posts: 507
Location: Zagreb -> Zapruđe

PostPosted: 25.12.2004 16:58    Post subject: Add user to your forum ignore list Reply with quote

Svaka čast! Applause

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random



Joined: 30 Jul 2004
Posts: 58
Location: Ri

PostPosted: 25.12.2004 17:14    Post subject: Add user to your forum ignore list Reply with quote

Peewee wrote:
je ti se seksualni zivot poboljso nakon ovog?
trebo bi sigurno!!!
svaka ti dala....


Applause
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Sulien



Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Posts: 2905
Location: Zagreb

PostPosted: 26.12.2004 13:38    Post subject: Add user to your forum ignore list Reply with quote

Peewee wrote:
je ti se seksualni zivot poboljso nakon ovog?
trebo bi sigurno!!!

Ne, pogoršao se

Ne kužim, zar ne vrijedi ono "chicks dig CSS" Confused
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/dev/null



Joined: 22 Dec 2004
Posts: 144

PostPosted: 26.12.2004 13:48    Post subject: Add user to your forum ignore list Reply with quote

Malo se ovaj CSS ne voli sa operom 7.54, ne da ga ne renda dobro nego je malo reci...
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djuk17



Joined: 06 Oct 2004
Posts: 45
Location: Nepoznata :-)

PostPosted: 26.12.2004 15:38    Post subject: Add user to your forum ignore list Reply with quote

Respect Razz

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bozob



Joined: 07 Mar 2004
Posts: 378
Location: Gruda, Konavle

PostPosted: 26.12.2004 16:11    Post subject: Add user to your forum ignore list Reply with quote

nAhSud wrote:
Respect Razz
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aesqe



Joined: 18 Sep 2003
Posts: 48
Location: zagreb

PostPosted: 26.12.2004 16:20    Post subject: Re: mi3dot bez tablica - right here :) Add user to your forum ignore list Reply with quote

opera (8 beta i 7.23) - manje vise izgleda dobro, par sitnica je mozda drugacije alignano ali to ne utjece na cjelinu, tako da sve izgleda "k'o pravo" Smile

ie6 (xpsp2) - ja vidim samo dva problema: ne prikazuje se pozadina ispod prvog reda "izdvojeno" i "pretrazi" box se nakon loadanja stranice cini raspadnut, a onda se sam sredi (?). sve ostalo mi je ok.

ovo gore sve na 'od oka' procjeni, nisam htio bio picajzla Smile

mac nemam, ali ak se netko moze sjetit onog sajta za testiranje prikaza u raznoraznim browserima... ?

svaka cast, sulien! odlican posao Applause

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Sulien



Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Posts: 2905
Location: Zagreb

PostPosted: 26.12.2004 18:47    Post subject: Re: mi3dot bez tablica - right here :) Add user to your forum ignore list Reply with quote

/dev/null wrote:
Malo se ovaj CSS ne voli sa operom 7.54, ne da ga ne renda dobro nego je malo reci...

aesqe wrote:
opera (8 beta i 7.23) - manje vise izgleda dobro, par sitnica je mozda drugacije alignano ali to ne utjece na cjelinu, tako da sve izgleda "k'o pravo" Smile

e sad... tko je u pravu? Smile

vidim da ću ubuduće morat imat instalirano što više browsera ako hoću radit nešto ozbiljno, neću uvijek moći pitat vas za feedback Confused

Quote:
mac nemam, ali ak se netko moze sjetit onog sajta za testiranje prikaza u raznoraznim browserima... ?

Idea e, da, pliz
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Peewee



Joined: 12 Jan 2004
Posts: 711
Location: Velika Gorica

PostPosted: 26.12.2004 19:37    Post subject: Add user to your forum ignore list Reply with quote

Sulien wrote:
Peewee wrote:
je ti se seksualni zivot poboljso nakon ovog?
trebo bi sigurno!!!

Ne, pogoršao se

Ne kužim, zar ne vrijedi ono "chicks dig CSS" Confused


coece ja sam dobio samo zato jer sam to vidio i reko da te znam s foruma Wink

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maratz
mi3.crew


Joined: 24 Nov 2003
Posts: 1207
Location: ZAG

PostPosted: 27.12.2004 00:55    Post subject: Add user to your forum ignore list Reply with quote

Safari: http://www.danvine.com/icapture/

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Sulien



Joined: 04 Jan 2004
Posts: 2905
Location: Zagreb

PostPosted: 29.12.2004 18:06    Post subject: Add user to your forum ignore list Reply with quote

@peewee: Laughing

@marac: whee!
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